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Halo 3 Ranking Explained
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| キューティーハニーCutie Honey ![]() | Halo 3 Ranking Explained Quote: There is one caveat to consider before we get under weigh. Bungie is not likely, nor or ever, to release the true inner workings of the Halo 3 ranking system, but as it is based somewhat on the Microsoft Trueskill system, this is a fair approximation of the way skill ranking works in Halo 3. Quote: What is the Trueskill system? Quote: How Does Trueskill Work? Mu is an approximation of your skill level based upon past performance. Win games to raise Mu, and lose games to lower Mu. Sigma is the numerical representation of the range in which your true skill could lie. Play really consistently, and you have a low Sigma. Play streakily, and you have a higher Sigma. After a win, the Trueskill system adjusts your skill ranking based upon the Mu and Sigma of all the players in the game. We'll go deeper into how much it is adjusted later. Trueskill systems use a conservative ranking Ranking = mu - (K * Sigma) so your skill is likely to be higher than the actual number represented in your Halo 3 highest skill level. K is a constant assigned an arbitrary value by the developers of the game. Quote: Why don't I level up after winning X games in a row? / Why does my friend go up three levels a game and I don't? Quote: So, I want a high Sigma value? Also, Sigma value starts out VERY high. So, if this is your friend's first time in a particular ranked hopper, and he wins consistently, his rank will rise meteorically due to his high Sigma. Quote: Myth Busting This means that out of all of these statistics: Getting the MVP Having a High K/D ratio Getting the most medals Skill levels of those you killed / killed you Weapons you used Headshots Captures, detonations, stops, ousts, etc. NONE of them matter when calculating the Mu increase/decrease. Any link between any of these and the skill ratings are purely correlative and not causative. For example. When I play Team Slayer with my buddies on my alternate gamertag, much of the time I end up carrying the team. I created this tag to play with my buddies, and as such, have only ever played on that party with that tag. I ranked up to the level of my friends within 20 or so games, while it had taken them 50 to 100 games to reach their level. My friends thought that it was because of my frequent MVP status and my high K/D ratio that I leveled up so fast. Wrong. I leveled up fast because A) I initially had a very high Sigma, making my Mu more variable after each win, B) Starting out at a 1 and playing people in the mid teens gave me a considerable boost every time I won, and C) We won more frequently than they had in the past. Quote: Summation Take your win/loss average. If it's 65% or above, and you've been in that playlist for a while, you've probably increased in level 2 or more times over the last 50 games (or you will in the next 20 or so). Otherwise you are going to be hovering around the same level or dropping in rank. Quote: Addendum, Opinion, and Technical Notes I also believe that the system is weighted so that the peak of the normal distribution is around level 20, not level 25. That means it will take more wins to level through 1-25 than it will 25-50. Which makes a bit of sense, if you don't want the highest levels too terribly crowded. The higher the Sigma of your opponents, the less Mu you gain from beating them. Predictable outcomes (e.g. win against a lower ranked opponent) are treated as statistically less significant. Upsets are given more weight. So, winning against lower ranked opponents doesn't do much for your Mu rating. Neither does losing against higher ranked ones. But beat a team that's 6 or more ranks above you and at least someone on your team will rank up. Trueskill ratings have no discernable correlation from hopper to hopper. When you play on a hopper you've never played on before, you are starting with a fresh Mu and a high Sigma. Team Mu and Team Sigma are the summation of the Mu and Sigma values of all the players on the team. When calculating the skill of an opponent in a team game, the system uses the Team Mu and Team Sigma values in calculation wherever rational. *Removed equations for space. They can be found in the link below.* The rest of the equations and a less Halo 3 centric analysis of the Trueskill system can be found here. __________________________________________________ _______ Important additions, Appendices, and Member Questions Answered __________________________________________________ _______ In-depth response to a post LoveNub made later in this thread. Should clear things up for some. More data analyzed, and a request for help with research Kudos to Jay120171 for finding the post detailing the Mixed Party Bug in matchmaking. Quote: "Why do I win 10 games and not level up, then delevel when I lose 2? Help!" Second, and this is enlightened conjecture, your Sigma value was low at the beginning of your streak, and since your win streak is raising it, the conservative ranking system (Remember, Rank = Mu MINUS (K times Sigma)) is kicking in to reduce your apparent skill level. Your real Mu is higher, but your higher Sigma is having a negative impact. mo0vaf00 writes: (edited to clarify intent) So is there some kind of value that requires you to be inconsistent to rank up? If I win 1 game going even and win the next going +10 do I have more of a chance of ranking up than just winning 2 games getting the same score? This conclusion is popping up fairly frequently. The answer is no. The system does not look at "In Match" statistics. At all. These stats are all included in a list above. The game only looks at your wins and your losses, and the strength of the opponents you play against. Also, the system does not "reward" you for having a high Sigma value. There is ONE positive associated with high Sigma, and there are TWO negatives. Positive: Your level can move up faster through winning. Negative: Your level can move down faster through losing. Negative: The conservative ranking system ranks you lower when your Sigma is higher. Higher Sigma simply means your level is more fluid. Sigma is good to have high when you are still reaching your appropriate skill level, but good to have low once you've reached it and are working on improving.
__________________ Last edited by l Krafty l; 08-26-2008 at 12:15 PM. |
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| The Following 13 Users Say Thank You to l Krafty l For This Useful Post: | Anonymous Joey (08-06-2008), b rad529 (12-19-2008), Babyobesity (10-06-2008), chaddy (07-21-2009), coder1 (07-02-2009), evofire (10-26-2009), Forgoten Dynasty (04-18-2008), |
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| Guest | Great Post! |
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| Se7en Sinner ![]() | Quote: The system does not look at "In Match" statistics. At all. These stats are all included in a list above. The game only looks at your wins and your losses, and the strength of the opponents you play against. Quote: If you suddenly developed a whole new level of headshot ability, for example you’d find that your skill level would rise commensurately second paragraph under "Rank Amatuers" apperantly it DOES matter if you get headshots, a high k/d Ratio and so on. I dont think MVP and medals really matter tho. Last edited by l Krafty l; 12-27-2007 at 02:49 PM. |
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| I'ma Do Me ![]() | Wow, then why every time I win 3 games I don't rank up..Then I lose 1 and go down a level.. |
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| | #5 |
| Se7en Sinner ![]() | Because it's NOT based on just Wins and Losses. It's based on K/d Ratio and Headshots, Etc. Things That Take skill to do. Anyone can use a B.R. and shoot somone, but it takes skill to B.R. someone in the head and only die one time in the match. |
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| | #6 |
| キューティーハニーCutie Honey ![]() | Wrong. Bungie.net : Inside Bungie : News second paragraph under "Rank Amatuers" apperantly it DOES matter if you get headshots, a high k/d Ratio and so on. I dont think MVP and medals really matter tho.
__________________ Last edited by l Krafty l; 12-27-2007 at 02:50 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost |
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| | #7 |
| Novice ![]() | And actually Scarecroe, what I belive was meant by the higher headshot ability is that he would get more kills, resulting in more wins, not getting a headshot specifically raises your skill. If you figure out the doubleshot and ue it, your rank will increase as well, because you will get more kills |
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| | #8 |
| Se7en Sinner ![]() | ^^ Ah I C.as for Krafty, I wasnt trying to be rude or anything i was just "correcting" what I "thought" was a "mistake" I was Wrong. |
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| | #9 |
| キューティーハニーCutie Honey ![]() | It was the fact that you inputted "QUOTED BY l KRAFTY l" in big bold letters which brought me to the question of why you were trying to bash me. |
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| Se7en Sinner ![]() | Apologies. |
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| Oh so Clutch ![]() | nice share, KRAF-TAYYYYY! |
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| Get It How U Live ![]() | this system works good in that your level is supposed to represent how good you are compared to all players, but isn't fair because people make new gamertags, de-level, play fu(ked up, etc. and would only be 100% accurate in a perfect world. i think it should just be based on which i think the h2 ranks were setup with the EXP. you win, you get EXP, lose and you drop EXP. beating higher ranked opponents would mean more EXP than against lower ranked opponents and visa-versa on the losing side. also i believe the higher the rank the more EXP it should take to rank up would make it better. in halo 2 when say a level 1 is playing with a level 28 it would make the level 1 the minimum rank that the level 28 could play with (probly between 19-21). i dont like this either because it just gets your team easier opponents to play. maybe it should put you to the middle of the allowed rank if your level is outside of the allowed level gap, but not sure if that would be fair or not since some low ranks who play with higher ranks truly are that level and deserve to play lower ranked opponents.... i know in h3 the system they're using doesnt help you much if you did this but does anyone know the details of how this works in h3 regarding to what level opponents are put together and wat happens when lopsided ranked kids play together?
__________________ "I <3 squats mother" - Psycho Homer Last edited by II{-_-}II; 12-27-2007 at 05:54 PM. |
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| | #13 |
| Junior Member | When Frankie wrote that "a whole new level of headshot ability," he meant that when you start getting better (ie: getting kills) Not literally out of context headshots |
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| | #14 |
| 7S Enthusiast | wow, crazy explanation, does anyone know what the level 4 brigadier is called?? |
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| | #15 |
| Premium Member ![]() | OMG wow, thats a very krafty view at things |
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| Novice | Good post. |
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| | #17 |
| キューティーハニーCutie Honey ![]() | Posted By:Achronos Quote: 1. Your individual performance during a team game doesn't matter - if you lost, you lost, it doesn't matter how well you did personally. 2. Rank progression is NOT linear. 3. Rank progression is based on consistency and the rank of your opponents. That is, if you always lose to higher level opponents, and win most but still lose some to equal level opponents, you won't go up that match. 4. If you lose to someone lower level than you, your rank is going to suffer more. Winning against lower level players is expected, and will not assist you in going up. 5. I cannot say this enough - just winning more than you lose isn't going to get you rank. It is but one requirement. As I said, if you're not beating higher leveled players consistently, you don't go up a level because you haven't earned it. 6. Rank will initially change often, but once you get to a certain point, the system becomes statistically certain about your level in a playlist, and just playing games and winning is no longer enough to go up - you have to consistently win against higher leveled players and not lose to lower level players. 7. Please, PLEASE stop assuming things aren't working because it doesn't work how it did in Halo 2. Playing and winning only guarentees your EXP goes up, it doesn't guarentee your skill level goes up. That depends on who you are playing. |
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| 7S Enthusiast | thanx finnaly some one explains it+ |
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| Member | good post good post very good Last edited by Sniperman-23; 05-31-2008 at 11:50 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost |
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| Novice | |
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